I'm new to this site and have been teaching myself to weave. I have an 8 harness and like a lot of the patterns in the 8 -shaft pattern book only I like them better the other way.
Instead of weaving horizontal stripes I want to weave them verticle, I think they'll look better in the scarf I want to make. Do you just thread the treadling and treadle the threading? Can it be that simple?
Thank you for your help.
Hi Marylynne....if you can tell us the source of your draft, perhaps we can tell you if it can be turned to weave as you desire......
Su
Hi Su,
the draft is on page 24 of a weavers book of 8-shaft patterns, its #80...I would like it to come out exactly like it is....
when I bought the book I was told that all the drafts were sideways, in other words.. turn the pics clockwise 1/4 turn and that will be what they look like when woven....
marylynne
Marylynne.....I am not sure why someone would tellyou that the drafts are depicted "sideways". This is just not true. The drafts in the Strickler 8-shaft book appear on the page just as they will on your loom. There is no need to turn this draft to get cloth as pictured. See the draft below....this is how the draft will weave.... since this draft has color changes in both warp and weft, there is not advantage to turning it to weave. If you turn this weave you will get horizontal stripes with the zig zag going horizontally across the web instead of vertically. Hope this helps. By the way, be aware there is a 9 thread warp float in this design, so use appropriate yarns.
Su, I wasn't sure how you could tell about the warp floats, but it's the spaces between the zig zag on the treadling right?
I want to use hand spun alpaca @8-9 wpi...will this work , what do you suggest?
also, can you tell me how to recognize whether the selvages are caught or if I need floating selvages....I keep messing up and its getting quite frustrating.
thanks, Mary
HI Mary......I use my computer software to find warp and weft floats for me, but you can do it by closely examining your draft and finding the areas where warps do not intersect with wefts or wefts do not intersect with warps. Count how many threads a warp or weft thread floats over before intersecting again and you will have the float length. In this case, there is a 9 thread warp float in every stripe. Weft floats on this side of the fabric are only 3 threads, but on the back they are 5 threads, and the warp has 5 thread floats on the reverse side as well. Look carefully at the draft below. It is sized to show pretty much what your pattern will look like when woven.
So if you plan to use your warp that wraps at 8-9 wpi, that must mean a sett of about 5-7 epi for twill. In turn you would probably want to weave it about 7 picks per inch as well. Now consider this, if you have a 9 thread warp float, that means the warp float will be nearly 11/3 inches long, and that is not an acceptable length,( in my opinion), for a float. It would catch on anything and everything around it. The only time this might be acceptable is if you planned on extreme fulling or felting, where the float would be secured to the weave through that process.
To be honest with you Mary, as pretty as this pattern is, I don't think I would attempt it using the yarn you are considering. A finer yarn, something about 24-30 wpi would work much better. I do not wish to discourage you, but I am not at all sure you would be satisfied with the cloth woven in such a heavy yarn......do you have enough yarn to weave up a small sample?
Re: Selvedges......you can tell if the selvedge is going to weave by looking at the floats at the outer edges of the draft. When a weft thread is under or over the last warp in the row and its opposite in the next row, the selvedge warp thread is being caught. When there is no weft thread showing on top or no warp thread showing on top of the edge most warp thread, the edge thread is NOT interlacing and will float. In this case, there is a 9 thread float, so there will be 9 picks where the selvedge threads do NOT interlace.....so a floating selvedge would probably be wise. Do you know how to set up a floating selvedge?
All in all Mary, I think I would advise you to choose another draft when working with a yarn as heavy as you are working with. Or use a smaller yarn for your warp, and then use your handspun in the weft. But whatever you do, if you can use a little yarn to weave a sample before you set up an entire project, you will learn a lot and waste just a little, and it may save you lots of frustration further down the road.
One other alternative is to add more intersections in this pattern. I have included another draft done with relatively thick warp and weft, but changed the tie up so the cloth will weave more areas of plain weave will still retaining some of the patterning you like in the original draft. This draft has no floats longer than 3 threads on the front and a warp float of 5 on the back. This could work better for your purposes. The pattern is a little different but still reminiscent of the original.
Hope that helps Mary…..
WOW!!!!!! You have been a huge help! There sure is a heck of a lot to weaving, I guess it will come with time.:) I am sooo glad you suggested to do another draft....you're right, I would've been very disappointed with the end result. I can visualize it now that I know what to look for. I do have enough for sampling but I don't want something that will have that problem. Gosh I"m glad I asked and I'm glad ya'll are here to help:)
About the finer fiber: its still a 9 float, but because its smaller is that why it would be okay? ...how did you figure out how long the float would be. comp. software?...and if I used fine in the warp and thick in the weft would that make it weft face?
As far as floating selvedges: I don't know if its the right way but I warp extra thread on my board, then just beam it with the rest and sley it through the reed but not in a heddle. Depending on what I am weaving I either dbl or single this thread.
I noticed in the new draft that its plain weave and twill, is there a way that 1 stripe could be all plain and the other be twill? or even keep the part that is blue and white like it is but the yellow would be plain and in solid color so the dark would pop... and would this be drapey ( is that a word) enough for a scarf for a guy or is that too feminine, the pattern I mean.Maybe I should just use another yarn...yoi
do twills always have a higher sett....or is it back to the issue of the yarn.....
Mary
HI Mary.....
Glad it was helpful...
You asked:
About the finer fiber: its still a 9 float, but because its smaller is that why it would be okay?
If you use yarns that are set at 12 ends per inch and have a 9 thread float, that float will measure 3/4 of an inch. If you have a warp sett at 18 ends per inch and have the same 9 thread float, that float will measure 1/2 inch and if you have a warp sett at 27 epi and have that same 9 thread float, it will measure 1/3 inch. So the sett plays a huge role in how long floats can be. So the answer is yes, the finer fiber can sustain a long float because the overall length of the float is shorter and will cause fewer problems.
You asked how my computer software figured the float....it simply is a programed action that searches for the longest points on both warp and weft where there are no intersections. Pretty much the same way you would do it yourself, only a lot faster, and more than likely, much more accurate than I am able to be.
and if I used fine in the warp and thick in the weft would that make it weft face?
Not necessarily. To make something weft-faced you use a more open sett and to make it more warp faced you use a denser sett.....doesn't really matter what yarn you are using if you vary the setts density based on the usual setts for that particular yarn.
You stated:
I noticed in the new draft that its plain weave and twill, is there a way that 1 stripe could be all plain and the other be twill?
Yes, you just draft the threading to weave plain weave in one stripe and twill in the other. You want to be careful about doing this though, because twill and plain weave take up differently and pack at different rates in the weft which can be problematic,, and they shrink differently and you could end up with ripply cloth
or even keep the part that is blue and white like it is but the yellow would be plain and in solid color so the dark would pop...
Once you understand what is happening in your drafts you can draft anything you want, as long as you have enough shafts to weave it. I would suggest you do some study on weave drafting so you can better understand how do these kinds of variations. Madelyn van der Hoogt's book, The Complete Book of Drafting for Handweavers is an excellent place to start. Work your way through the exercises in the book until you have a better handle on how to draft.
and would this be drapey ( is that a word) enough for a scarf for a guy or is that too feminine, the pattern I mean.Maybe I should just use another yarn...
Plain weave is not as "drapey" as twill.....so by adding a lot of plain weave you would be sacrificing some drape. However, the materials you use can make a lot of difference too. A plain weave scarf in one fiber might not drape while another, say of Tencel or other regenerated cellulose/protein fiber willl drape very well.....you said it in the beginning of your post....there *IS* a lot to this weaving, and it does come with time, practice and study.
Pick a starting point and learn as much as you can and move forward from there....
Happy Weaving....
Whoops....forgot to answer your question about twill sett......yes, twill is usually sett at a more dense sett than plain weave.
Su...
thank you so much for all your help and info on the various questions. I will certainly get the drafting book for my library and read read read, maybe it will also teach me how to read the profile draft........ahhhhh so many things I want to learn......I've been thinking of taking one draft at a time from Stricklers 8 shaft book , it sounds like fun to me..and chalenging.
thanks again,
Thanks to both of you for this exchange. I learned a lot from it.
Su, you are always a huge help when people have questions. I learn something every time. Thank you for your generosity.
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